Orchids for ID - thanks

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HNG
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Orchids for ID - thanks

Post by HNG » Tue Jun 09, 2015 9:41 pm

I always struggle to sort the purple orchids. If anyone can put a name to these would be very grateful. Both found in Silverdale area of Lancashire.
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Orchid1.jpg
Orchid2-NMO.jpg

Peachysteve
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Re: Orchids for ID - thanks

Post by Peachysteve » Wed Jun 10, 2015 5:15 am

I also struggle to confidently ID these Orchids so I'm not going to offer suggestions but this site http://www.british-wild-flowers.co.uk/i ... lowers.htm has some good images including many of the hybrids.
That might be a useful reference.

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Re: Orchids for ID - thanks

Post by JennyS » Wed Jun 10, 2015 5:23 pm

It's a Dactylorhiza and being from Lancashire it's likely to be Dactylorhiza purpurella, Northern Marsh-orchid
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Gracie
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Re: Orchids for ID - thanks

Post by Gracie » Wed Jun 10, 2015 5:35 pm

A lot of our Orchid hybridise and can be very difficult to identify we have a lot of Southern Marsh Orchids locally that are a dark purple the key I think to which it is- are the leaves spotted or marked in any way, southern marsh do not have any spots or marks but the northern can do, low down near the root, they can be spots or dark marks going side ways along the leaf.

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Re: Orchids for ID - thanks

Post by diggleken » Wed Jun 10, 2015 6:04 pm

I'm with Joan, Southern Marsh - just cos we are up north doesn't mean we have mainly Northern Marsh, in fact they are second to Southern Marsh in commonality in most places up here.
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Re: Orchids for ID - thanks

Post by JennyS » Wed Jun 10, 2015 7:00 pm

Sorry I forgot Southern Marsh-orchid extended further north, but the lip markings still look more like those of Northern Marsh-orchid ........
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Gracie
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Re: Orchids for ID - thanks

Post by Gracie » Thu Jun 11, 2015 12:09 pm

I have looked in all my books and you know the photos differ from book to book! Not helping at all, in the Collins Flower Guides your photo could be either, it's not easy doing the orchids. sorry couldn't be more helpful.

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adampembs
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Re: Orchids for ID - thanks

Post by adampembs » Thu Jun 11, 2015 1:10 pm

From my Francis Rose "Wildflower key"

The differences are that D.purpurella is much shorter (10-25cm) than D.praetermissa (20-60cm tall)
The lower flower lip of D.purpurella is supposed to be shield or diamond shaped.
The pattern and shape of the lip looks more like D.traunsteineri but that is just from the book, not from any expert experience.

Good to know if stem is hollow or solid?
Photo of base leaves and whole plant to see spots would be good
Where was it growing? Habitat wise - I am not familiar with Silverdale, Lancashire, as I live some 300 miles away :-) Is it fresh water marsh or brackish etc?

As others have said, there are also hybrids :(
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Chris Yeates
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Re: Orchids for ID - thanks

Post by Chris Yeates » Thu Jun 11, 2015 9:18 pm

For what it's worth I would say the top one is mostly southern marsh (but those loops suggest there is some back-crossing with common spotted); the lower one is close to my understanding of northern marsh . . .
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Re: Orchids for ID - thanks

Post by HNG » Thu Jun 11, 2015 9:29 pm

There were definatly no spots on the leaves of either specimen. Both were in a quarry area [different quarries]. Thank you all for giving it a go. Much apprieciated.

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